http://claws.za.net/forum/ Forums of the Cape Union of Adventurers and Wargamers en Fri, 10 Sep 2010 23:08:24 +0000 http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-575 Fri, 15 Jun 2007 16:14:16 +0000 StormMaker 575@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Steps out from the mist and slurs:</p> <p>@ Yanke<br /> "Ye there are some cheaper games. ASL is all cardboard,"<br /> And RPG's are just books and pieces of paper and plastic dice, the whole industry is about making so much more with the props given. I think a game that requires more intelligence and imagination, given that it may have a smaller fan base as the IQ lvl's increase, should be cherished not derided.</p> <p>" but people arent falling over themselves to play it cuz many consider it boring. (due to lack of Pizazz, and frankly some people like simpler rules.)"<br /> Yes I do concede this, but can the same not be said about RPG and wargames versus CCG. It seems the modern consumer wants less concentration and thought with more engaged interaction. Take the rise of game consoles, heck why bother to think just sit and mentally masturbate whilst pushing your little controller buttons. We roleplay because we want more, we wargame because we want in depth interaction, personally ASL is another link to explore the dynamic that was WWII.</p> <p>Simpler is not better, just simpler, and if you find complexity boring and a real link to historic battle a lack of Pizazz (ASL has an incredible link to real history in WWII) and thus a need for realism, then yes ASL is not for you. </p> <p>But to shoot a game down because its too complex for you, is a fool making an argument where they self identify, and you ain't no fool, otherwise you would be playing a first person shooter, or facebook or watching weeble.... </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-430 Thu, 17 May 2007 20:26:18 +0000 CryoPhobia 430@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Without the dice it would not be called a game now would it :) </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-411 Thu, 17 May 2007 00:37:01 +0000 Yancke 411@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>And seriously, warhammer 40/fantasy, is what it is and is popular. If you dont like it dont play, as you clearly have opted to do. I stopped too after spending many many Rands. (Large Darkangels and Tyranids models) And Many many hours of painting/customising/sculpting.<br /> Stop yer bitching.</p> <p>Beside I think Wysiwig was a good idea. I was soooo tired of coke can dreadnaughts and God knows what else. I can actually paint minutures and i think it forced people to put together better looking models. So whatever.</p> <p>And frankly some of those models look fantastic. Where do you get models that cool?<br /> Ye there are some cheaper games. ASL is all cardboard, but people arent falling over themselves to play it cuz many consider it boring. (due to lack of Pizazz, and frankly some people like simpler rules.) I will concede the massive luck factor involved, but whey are you surprised.</p> <p>Those cubes are called dice. You know? Random chance. </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-410 Thu, 17 May 2007 00:26:48 +0000 Yancke 410@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>I hate you all for not playing L5r. But aparently they are busy with a board game so maybe i can getpeople intersted when it comes out. </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-393 Mon, 30 Apr 2007 20:50:57 +0000 CryoPhobia 393@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>StormMaker's post touches on 2 important points. </p> <p>Games Workshop Games is not cheap and they know how to run the money machine:<br /> "I am sure to be flamed for this but Gamesworkshop and its products are to<br /> wargaming, as Diesel to clothing retail."</p> <p>The following is my take on it so YMMV. I played WH40K for 2 years before the change to the 4th Edition release and collected 3 armies. As everyone knows with the 4th Edition came the changes to the codexes and as a result new armies "forcing" you to start looking at new units to comply with the WYSIWYG type of army building. At this point I decided enough is enough, what was meant to be a clarification of rules was going to result in me spending more money to keep up with the new "put your race here" rules. </p> <p>Games Workshop could just as well be printing money. Now, I think any miniature based game is expensive purely based on the exchange rate, e.g. Rackham - <a href="http://www.rackham.fr/html/home.php?lg=EN" rel="nofollow">http://www.rackham.fr/html/home.php?lg=EN</a> and Flames of War - <a href="http://www.battlefront.co.nz" rel="nofollow">http://www.battlefront.co.nz</a> ), but constant rules and army updates is silly. </p> <p>I've seen guys playing Rackham, the guys imported the miniatures themselves and Flames of War is distributed in SA by SA Miniatures - <a href="http://www.saminiatures.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.saminiatures.com</a> . This brings me to StormMaker's 2nd point (Actually his 1st point).</p> <p>War gaming does not equal WarHammer / WarHammer 40K:<br /> "No disrespect intended but I think it is a very sad indication of the sorry state of wargaming if the current situation in CT is only that of Warhammer and the products of Games workshop."</p> <p>So very true. There are a various types of war games out there:</p> <p>- Miniature based<br /> - Counter based<br /> - Block games</p> <p>these are again grouped into tactical, strategy and operational type games, with minis falling in the tactical group. </p> <p>Strategy and operational games are again split into hex, area and point-2-point movement games. </p> <p>And if this isn't enough these games have varying game mechanics beyond just movement, i.e. dice based, card driven, I go you go (IGYG) and impulse driven.</p> <p>I am sure the above is not exhaustive, but covers the most common types. So yes, playing only an IGYG miniature war game is a sorry state of war gaming. </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-390 Mon, 23 Apr 2007 14:46:01 +0000 ricekake87 390@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>this is true. </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-388 Mon, 23 Apr 2007 11:05:21 +0000 confluence 388@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Aha! Maybe I should read instead of skimming. It was top-posted, though. ;) </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-387 Mon, 23 Apr 2007 08:35:39 +0000 keeper 387@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>The e-mail concerning the wargaming is included in StormMakers original post. </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-385 Sat, 21 Apr 2007 13:50:15 +0000 confluence 385@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Dude, <em>StormMaker</em> doesn't like Warhammer. I think he's the only person who said anything (disparaging or otherwise) about it; the rest of the thread is a flamewar about Diplomacy.</p> <p>There isn't more wargaming discussion here because the forum isn't very well-attended. I do know at least two CLAWs people who are warhammer enthusiasts (but I don't think they post here). I think they play in tournaments, and stuff; I don't know details because I'm not a wargamer myself.</p> <p>There was some discussion on our chat mailing list, Cthfuchsia (which this forum is supposed to replace); in fact, this thread was started as a response to an email about wargaming, which had info about people playing Warhammer. I'll ask the writer if I can repost it here. </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-384 Sat, 21 Apr 2007 11:02:44 +0000 ricekake87 384@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>wow. you guys (and girls) realy take warhammer badly. my friends and i joined Claws so that we could meet other enthusiasts.<br /> Was I wrong?<br /> plz assist in my transformation.<br /> Ricekake87. </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-327 Sat, 24 Mar 2007 16:56:25 +0000 CryoPhobia 327@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p><strong>dystopia</strong></p> <p>Thank you so much for your reply. I see you failed to notice my sarcasm.</p> <blockquote><p>you say you didn't read the thread, therefore your rights to make comments can't be revoked because they don't exist.</p></blockquote> <p>No worries though, you did answer my question in the end.</p> <blockquote><p>no, we have a mutant hybrid. though, it is mostly pbem, with semi live play for those interested</p></blockquote> <p>Chris </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-324 Wed, 21 Mar 2007 16:45:52 +0000 confluence 324@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p><em>p.s you are a nazi. so the flamewar is over</em></p> <p><em>p.p.s confluece: does that mean that i can delete his account now?</em></p> <p>No no no, you see, <em>you</em> invoked the Common Misconception of Godwin's Law; that means that <em>you</em> automagically lose and <em>he</em> deletes your account. Or at least he could if he had admin access.</p> <p>I vote that you mud-wrestle instead, and record the event on your camera phone.</p> <p>ETA: I thought CryoPhobia was someone he is in fact not; silly me. :D </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-323 Wed, 21 Mar 2007 14:19:44 +0000 dystopia 323@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p><strong>cryophobia</strong><br /> you say you didn't read the thread, therefore your rights to make comments can't be revoked because they don't exist. secondly, i will demonstrate how a consensus was reached, if you missed it. i described a style of play, then i mentioned that i was going to run a game in that style. everything else was fluff that people felt they needed to contribute. i have no desire to use any of the suggested methods and at no point did i even vaguely express an interest in them.</p> <blockquote><p>I am correct to understand an agreement on how the game should be run is still in debate here?</p></blockquote> <p>no, there is no debate, there never was.</p> <blockquote><p>Here is an offer to run the game. But unfortunately you do not have all the components. It seems you are still looking for assistance and I do not see a final decision.</p></blockquote> <p>the components are not hard to find, and the interested players can help me out there. (plus i now have a 2megapixel phone on my camerea, which should be adequate)</p> <blockquote><p>So here we have a live and pbem game options offered. After discussing a few ways of doing it including pbem clients and what not, by the forum members, I still see no consensus.</p></blockquote> <p>no, we have a mutant hybrid. though, it is mostly pbem, with semi live play for those interested</p> <blockquote><p>Yes, you are correct I did not read this the 1st time; I did not even participate in the thread. What was I thinking asking this silly question? Oh it’s because I actually failed to see a finale decision made. So I will ask the question again, Will the game be pbem? If so what client will be used? Or more specific, what pbem client will be used?</p></blockquote> <p>and just because i am feeling reall grown up about this: your suck</p> <p>p.s you are a nazi. so the flamewar is over</p> <p>p.p.s confluece: does that mean that i can delete his account now? </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-322 Tue, 20 Mar 2007 16:04:25 +0000 confluence 322@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Our first non-meta flamewar! The forum is all grown up! </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-321 Tue, 20 Mar 2007 15:43:24 +0000 StormMaker 321@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>I am still keen</p> <p>either way</p> <p>lets have a suggestion for a start time and a call for final players</p> <p>possibly if it was combined with social gathering?</p> <p>ironic givn how we sit on a slope, how slow and difficult momentum is</p> <p>oohh and finally</p> <p>kiss my spartan hair products; munchin is a cool game (at least I think it ;=]&gt;) </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame/page/2#post-320 Mon, 19 Mar 2007 17:15:46 +0000 CryoPhobia 320@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Are you serious?</p> <p>You said:</p> <blockquote><p>in the cthfuschia posts there was a lot of talk of play by email diplomacy. i have someone's copy of diplomacy and have often thought that it would make a fantastic play by email game. i am willing to host a game, but i would need some assistance (mostly to keep darkoutthere from killing me). we can start almost as soon as there are enough players and we can agree on how it wouid be run</p></blockquote> <p>I am correct to understand an agreement on how the game should be run is still in debate here?</p> <blockquote><p>my thought was to use a digital camera and email the layout of the board after each turn. only problem is that i don't have one, so i would need a lovely assistant. now we just need some more players</p></blockquote> <p>Here is an offer to run the game. But unfortunately you do not have all the components. It seems you are still looking for assistance and I do not see a final decision.</p> <blockquote><p>i think all of you have missed the point of my offer. i have the board game, but i think that the get together and play for 20 hours style of play is a little much. also, i don't have the time for that (even on weekends, before you ask). i quite like the idea of moving the pieces around on a real board, and to allow people to come over and look at something tangible. people could come over to watch the turns being played out, or they could wait for the email to go out</p> <p>my offer still stands, to run the game as i described it</p> <p>p.s i am keen to play board games, i have a swanky one called rune bound that needs playing </p></blockquote> <p>So here we have a live and pbem game options offered. After discussing a few ways of doing it including pbem clients and what not, by the forum members, I still see no consensus.</p> <blockquote><p>right, so now that some time has past and the flames have died down a bit, we can try this again. so far i have schpat and stormthingy interested in diplomancy, is anyone else interested? we need seven players</p></blockquote> <p>Yes, you are correct I did not read this the 1st time; I did not even participate in the thread. What was I thinking asking this silly question? Oh it’s because I actually failed to see a finale decision made. So I will ask the question again, Will the game be pbem? If so what client will be used? Or more specific, what pbem client will be used?</p> <p>Feel free to answer or ignore. I am sure you have your player openings filled already. </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-319 Mon, 19 Mar 2007 13:11:10 +0000 dystopia 319@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>my dear cryophobia, please reread my posts before asking questions that prove that you haven't </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-318 Wed, 14 Mar 2007 14:31:35 +0000 CryoPhobia 318@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Will the game be pbem? If so what client will be used? </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-317 Mon, 12 Mar 2007 16:46:01 +0000 dystopia 317@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>right, so now that some time has past and the flames have died down a bit, we can try this again. so far i have schpat and stormthingy interested in diplomancy, is anyone else interested? we need seven players </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-313 Thu, 01 Mar 2007 13:07:06 +0000 OOPMan 313@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Could be trouble getting in, since I'm a ways out (N1 city area...) </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-312 Thu, 01 Mar 2007 12:41:35 +0000 CryoPhobia 312@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>No problem - but do drop me an email sometime :) </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-311 Wed, 28 Feb 2007 13:27:12 +0000 OOPMan 311@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Munchkin doesn't qualify, since it's a crap game :-)</p> <p>The pirates game sounds cool... </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-310 Wed, 28 Feb 2007 13:05:10 +0000 StormMaker 310@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Eer what is Koi-Koi (besides what stutterers call the fish in the pond)</p> <p>But possibly I should say that on the card list...</p> <p>Getting back to the board game debate</p> <p>I think a Diplomacy game run over email, messages, popping into houses to push armies around is a great idea. A board set up in a central place that can be viewed and backed up with an emailed turn could work, and is low tech. We could take turns in going through the turns and keep track on our own boards.</p> <p>The general endorsement of wargames and board games is great too. How about a monthly games evening where who ever has games brings them and who ever pitches plays?</p> <p>Could I ask those on the forum to indicate what games they have?</p> <p>For my part I have: Munchkin, killer bunies, and pirates of the spanish main (I have lots of little ships to play sea battles with)<br /> I still am keen to get into ASL (sorry Chris for no email for so long) </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-302 Tue, 27 Feb 2007 15:45:22 +0000 confluence 302@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p><a href="http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/44?replies=1#post-301">We've already got one; it's very nice.</a> </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-300 Tue, 27 Feb 2007 15:15:05 +0000 OOPMan 300@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Indeed :-)</p> <p>Now, how about adding Traditional Card games so we can talk about Warhammer, Diplomacy AND Koi-Koi in one thread! </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-299 Tue, 27 Feb 2007 15:01:19 +0000 confluence 299@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>There we go. </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-298 Tue, 27 Feb 2007 14:45:35 +0000 CryoPhobia 298@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Good idea </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-297 Tue, 27 Feb 2007 14:36:49 +0000 confluence 297@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>Since these things seem to go together like cheese and bananas, how about we rename this forum category to "Wargames and Boardgames"? </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-296 Tue, 27 Feb 2007 14:33:57 +0000 CryoPhobia 296@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>I would love to see how Rune Bound compares to Descent at some stage. </p> http://claws.za.net/forum/topic/warhammer-the-sham-wargame#post-295 Tue, 27 Feb 2007 14:32:15 +0000 OOPMan 295@http://claws.za.net/forum/ <p>I like Board games, well, cool ones anyway :-)</p> <p>A few years back, when Tim was still in CT he used to pick up games now and then...</p> <p>We played some really cool ones, including the Game of Thrones boardgame and at least one other cool one... </p>